(NASC) National Access and Scaffolding Confederation

We all know that scaffolders have always had the reputation for being hard drinking lunatics, the thing is, most of the youngsters today try and live up to it.

The sad part about it is that most of the good lads working today have moved on from the old days.
 
I would agree with that Dass but you wouldn't have stopped even to draw breath if some old know all git tried to tell you to slow down.
 
Two things make a great scaffolder from a good scaffolder

1 pride

2 a fussy *******

That is it, nothing else, the pride and fussy comes from you don't want another scaffolder to Walk by and slag it off. That was my philosophy.

Ian
 
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Well said Jason,there is a problem mate,and the powers at be don"t give a hoot!

---------- Post added at 06:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:48 PM ----------

Well said Jason,there is a problem mate,and the powers at be don"t give a hoot!
 
simian said:
Two things make a great scaffolder from a good scaffolder

1 pride

2 a fussy *******

That is it, nothing else, the pride and fussy comes from you don't want another scaffolder to Walk by and slag it off. That was my philosophy.

Ian
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I try to teach our apprentices that way , Tell them to pretend there is an old ex scaffolder watching them and to imagine what he is thinking to himself while they are working , like being too slow, not knowing what they doing , does it look tidy or rough etc etc

basically trying to get them into the mind set of being concious of how they ercect the scaffold and if everything is neat tidy and safe.
 
hey jason.. i fully agree with quite alot of what you say and i luv ur passion for a such a young em, without trying to sound condersending, perhaps its time to start ur own company and see how it is on the darkside cos beleave me mate it aint all rossess and dosh - i agree with all ur pride statement etc on many differnt rants..i mean threads.. in my humble opinion pride of work comes with experiance and time served, the more u know wot to do, and how to do it correctly, the more u do.
unfortunatly somewhere along the line making money for yourself or company has to take over, i always say give me a unlimited budjet and time and i'll give u anything u want, but u know that aint gonna appen:D

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the money making machine of the citb colleges rake in dosh by passing everyone and anyone who comes through the door - does anyone know of anybody that has failed a course. birtchem even make you sighn paperwork that marrys u to there local tech colledge so they gain additional funding ...even though u've never been to it, quite frankly its a joke

after 25 years i took my Advanced last year and was surprised to find the course full of 22year olds, who had only passed there part 2 the year before,many claiming to be the site chargehand, and not one could read a proper drawing, they all talked a good job but none wanted to go down a dropper, or could set out properly..Gov stats and hse in there race to hit targets have forgotten the proper use of appenticeships, time served guys on the tools,and in house training incl the old assessment route of entry schemes,in favour of buck passing and allowing unelected self govening bodies under the guize of the nasc to speak, act and provide so called recomendations for us while they get fatter on our hard work and constant spending to try and keep up with there slightest whim
 
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southernpoofter said:
hey jason.. i fully agree with quite alot of what you say and i luv ur passion for a such a young em, without trying to sound condersending, perhaps its time to start ur own company and see how it is on the darkside cos beleave me mate it aint all rossess and dosh - i agree with all ur pride statement etc on many differnt rants..i mean threads.. in my humble opinion pride of work comes with experiance and time served, the more u know wot to do, and how to do it correctly, the more u do.
unfortunatly somewhere along the line making money for yourself or company has to take over, i always say give me a unlimited budjet and time and i'll give u anything u want, but u know that aint gonna appen:D
Click to expand...

Thats a good reply.

One day id like to start my own firm up, but im short the £30,000 or so you need for it, lol.

Even then, i just cant see myself mugging fellow Scaffolders off over the rate ill be paying them... i certainly wont offer them £10 an hour, like some jokers here have been.


southernpoofter said:
the money making machine of the citb colleges rake in dosh by passing everyone and anyone who comes through the door - does anyone know of anybody that has failed a course. birtchem even make you sighn paperwork that marrys u to there local tech colledge so they gain additional funding ...even though u've never been to it, quite frankly its a joke

after 25 years i took my Advanced last year and was surprised to find the course full of 22year olds, who had only passed there part 2 the year before,many claiming to be the site chargehand, and not one could read a proper drawing, they all talked a good job but none wanted to go down a dropper, or could set out properly..Gov stats and hse in there race to hit targets have forgotten the proper use of appenticeships, time served guys on the tools,and in house training incl the old assessment route of entry schemes,in favour of buck passing and allowing unelected self govening bodies under the guize of the nasc to speak, act and provide so called recomendations for us while they get fatter on our hard work and constant spending to try and keep up with there slightest wim
Click to expand...

Theres many Scaffolders who cant read drawings, id estimate that out of every 10 i work with atleast 5 cant read a drawing and atleast 3 cant tie a tube off...

How many who: 'Talk a good job', but dont know the difference between a Double and a 3ft Board end up as Foreman or Supervisors?
LOTS and LOTS and LOTS, lol.


Theres an awful lot that the NASC and CITB need to address and even more that they need to answer for.
 
Jason, surely all your experiences with management haven't been that bad. Have they?
 
No, ive had some good ones.

But people dont like being told that they couldn't run a bath... I have a bad habit of saying that, a bit too often, lol.
 
like alot swifty lolo

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jason
with reguard to the drawings mate...once again ur right, but that because no one teaches not even citb on there courses , so it back again to asking the older scaffs who do know. or trying to learn by mistakes but remember sh.it always runs downhill and stops at the fixers doorlolo

also its very easy for anyone to be critical of a managment decision that you dont like or agree with if u've never had to make a similar,and let face it most spanners are treated like mushrooms on a need to know basis
 
True.

You pay £1000 for a 2 week course, which is usually 8 hours a day, 5 days a week.
In that time you'd think that they would slip in a few hours, if that just to go over the basics of reading drawings and how to correctly tie tubes off.

Even basic First Aid would be handy to include, especially if they are on about increasing the RIDDOR to 7 days, instead of the usual 3.
 
8 hrs -5 days ..dnt make me laugh didn't start b4 1030 on 1st day- 9ish on the others- bloody tea breaks every cpl of hours and finished around 11 on the fridays...if the other students had known what they were doin instead of trying to talk the job up, u could prob complete the whole course workload in 5 days...and whats the2 day assement all about another way of conning a monkey outta u....c wot i mean money money money or should i sayanother bullsh.it tax !!
 
Thats what i mean.
Theres plenty of time to teach the other stuff, if it was done properly.
 
In regards to training I think it is now too long winded, with the apprentices we have or have qualified the biggest problem is the portfolio....With utmost respect most lads havent got the first clue how to complete this document and leave it till the last minute so its a big rush trying to get it completed for them prior to there next course....I think it needs simplifing.

With the actual courses all the lads tell me they are just milling around a lot of the time and even I know from personel experience doing my Part 1 in 1988 :)D Yes...Im an old git!!) at Bircham Newton it could have easily been done in a week...I appreciate the course is run to the pace of the slowest candidate but I think a week of actually 8 or 9 hour days would have done it.

I cant understand lads not understanding drawings however...EVERY project undertaken on every course is to a drawing...I appreciate complicated schemes may need so going over but basic indepedents...hmmmm

In regards to failure....I no of not one lad who has failed a scaffold course...HOWEVER...When I was a Manager with SGB I sent one lad for his Part 1 at Safety In Access in Nottingham and halfway through they called me and told me that this particular lad was really struggling and they thought he was going to fail....So we put together a little action plan between us to get him up to speed and he passed...just...So it just goes to show eh?

Getting back to the original thread of the NASC....Anyone who knows me knows my position....Basically in the region we operate in the organisation is nothing more than an old boys club...I shall say no more.
 
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I agree with your observations on the training but I would prefer to tackle it a different way. I would prefer to keep the course times as is as the longer they spend in the centers theoretically the more they should learn but as we all know this is not the case at the moment but are the centers hands bound by the curriculum and if that is the problem take the leash of the instructors and let them do the job they were trained to do? Challenge the young team at every opportunity and make them graft on other structures if they are walking all over the course. If you have a mixed ability group the chances are they would get swept along by the better hands and improve them selves but if not just let them work on the standard structures until such times as they are ready. It is my belief that with that kind of incentive in the centers every one would graft as hard as they could to prove themselves as no one would want to be left behind.

The more I think about it the more I think I fancy being an instructor when the guns get hung up, I may have to travel though as some comments have not gone unnoticed and my employ-ability with some will be pretty slim but I would make damn sure that every boy that came through my door left with a lot more knowledge and ability than he came with.
 
The guys on the courses which dont have much experience on the spanners usually end up labouring for most of the two weeks and get pulled through by the experienced lads.

I think at the end of the day we all know these are just more of appreciation courses in an ideal world as you know when you get out in the real world half the time the gear is **** and there is always something or some **** labourer in the way! ha ha!

Its a case of here's the info now go and put it into practice, if you dont you forget it and end up being dragged along and having your arse covered by the ones who apply what they have learned.

Just my opinion though.
 
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