What is the best tie use used and why.

aom

aom

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What is the best tie you have used and why.

In a moment of weakness I recently purchased 40 quicktie brackets and screw bolts from leach's. I know I know, over priced rubbish, but I have been looking for an alternative to the 18mm drop in anchor for a while and thought I would give those a try. Instead of speeding up the operation it is taking almost twice as long to fit as the origional ties. So far every one has passed the pull test but the voice in my head is saying they seem very light weight for the job. Just wondered if anyone else is using these or any suggestions for a better one.
 
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aom

I cannot see the advantages of this Tie System over the Hilti Anchor System, its only as strong as its weakest link i.e. tieing from the eye bolt to the Scaffold is not ridged and gives rise to movement---what do you use to tie it back twine, wire lashings ?, its too much feckin around...
My personal preferance is the Hilti less components and ridged...
 
Tie type depends on the substrate (as always) but for for general purpose tying, I recommend the Apollo scaffold plug and eyebolt used in conjunction with a 'hook coupler' - the eyebolt can be re-used meaning the only 'consumable item' is the plug
One thing to bear in mind when using the drop in anchor (Hilti HKD for example) is the expansion forces involved & required edge distance - 230mm for the 16mm anchor for example - this basically means a concrete column needs to be a minimum of 460mm in width, which in my experience is very uncommon
 
Garry Adams said:
aom

I cannot see the advantages of this Tie System over the Hilti Anchor System, its only as strong as its weakest link i.e. tieing from the eye bolt to the Scaffold is not ridged and gives rise to movement---what do you use to tie it back twine, wire lashings ?, its too much feckin around...
My personal preferance is the Hilti less components and ridged...
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Garry,

This might be farming country as is Aberdeen, but there is no baling twine used on any of our jobs. Not very computer litterate or I would give you a link to show you the bracket but it's basically a half back double to recieve the tie tube with quite a large face plate to fix in to the wall with. Nothing wrong with the hilti, I was just trying to see if there were any better alternatives without standing around for an eternity trying to get a 18mm hole into granite. Looking at the brochure I felt this is a maybe as there is no consumables as the bolts are re-usable and as I said they have all passed the pull test, but really struggling to screw them up with the recommended 12mm drill bit. Still waiting for data from supplier.:mad:

---------- Post added at 01:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:22 PM ----------

Joneng,

I used the appollo once on a job and thought they were great. They were erecting with all-round and using an 800mm tranny hooked in to the ring and tied back to one inside standard. It was a few years back mind,:unsure: but I have never seen them since.
 
not sure if i've used the apollo ties, tried them threaded ring bolts & nylon plugs, didnt rate them too much side to side movement, i like the excalibur bolts that thread themselves into stonework used with a band & plate bolt through one or both holes of band makes for a very strong tie:)
 
Orac said:
not sure if i've used the apollo ties, tried them threaded ring bolts & nylon plugs, didnt rate them too much side to side movement, i like the excalibur bolts that thread themselves into stonework
Click to expand...

They are the dogs mate...although we have 1000s of rings and continue to use them basically just for that reason only but the excalibur is the way forward.
 
Orac said:
not sure if i've used the apollo ties, tried them threaded ring bolts & nylon plugs, didnt rate them too much side to side movement, i like the excalibur bolts that thread themselves into stonework used with a band & plate bolt through one or both holes of band makes for a very strong tie:)
Click to expand...

Orac,

That's the one I'm talking about, as I said we are really struggling to screw them home in stone, are you using a 12mm bit?
 
I do specify the 'sef tappers' when applicable, just be aware that they are ulimately 'consumable' - while they can be re-used, the will wear down & lose their effectiveness (rule of thumb being, if they become harder to turn, they are shot)
 
JonEng said:
I do specify the 'sef tappers' when applicable, just be aware that they are ulimately 'consumable' - while they can be re-used, the will wear down & lose their effectiveness (rule of thumb being, if they become harder to turn, they are shot)
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These feckers are brand new and you need forearms like pop eye to get them turned. Maybe I bought a load of crap ones. The ones I have, have 6 double threads running the lenth of the bolt although I have seen the ones that have 12 single threads. Do you reckon that could make the difference.
 
aom

Thats the one we use...although pretty tight they have always wrapped up with a normal rachet quite easily, is your drill bit the right size? do you maybe want to try a 13mm? Then again we as a rule will go only into masonry or concrete, granite may be a different proposition.
 
PW said:
aom

Thats the one we use...although pretty tight they have always wrapped up with a normal rachet quite easily, is your drill bit the right size? do you maybe want to try a 13mm? Then again we as a rule will go only into masonry or concrete, granite may be a different proposition.
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We are using a 12mm bit and yes I'd love to try a 13mm bit but a bit unsure where that will leave me in the event of failure. I have been in touch with supplier who has promised to get back to me but if no one else is having problems that means it's either something we are doing or they can't handle granite. What they did say was in soft brick use an 11mm bit so you would think in harder surfaces you could use a slightly bigger bit.
 
aom

Sincere apologies regarding the " Twine "---in my haste I miss read your post and surmised that you were talking about the 16m Eye Bolt Type :embarrest:

You started a good thread and excellent info from the Guys...
 
No bother Garry, info as usual very helpful. Certainly better than the mob that are selling the stuff.
 
aom said:
We are using a 12mm bit and yes I'd love to try a 13mm bit but a bit unsure where that will leave me in the event of failure. I have been in touch with supplier who has promised to get back to me but if no one else is having problems that means it's either something we are doing or they can't handle granite. What they did say was in soft brick use an 11mm bit so you would think in harder surfaces you could use a slightly bigger bit.
Click to expand...

You could try a larger bit & 'proof test' maybe?

Perform a minimum of five preliminary pull tests to twice the required safe working load - if any fail, average them out & using the lowest figure from:

Average test load / 3

OR

Lowest test load / 2

Base the tie pattern on that figure
 
Joneng,

Cheers for that, sounds like my best option for the tougher stuff. We have probably ripped the backside out of the bolts we have already inserted as I am quite sure they would have passed a test less than half way in. Wish I could say the same about my personal life, but that's another web site.:D
 
No probs - let us know how you get on

*tie related info only please* :laugh:
 
Hi All,

Have been using UPAT brass anchor and plugs with Pig-tails very fast and pass the push/pull all the time and you get your anchors back and leave the plastic plug behind, very good on price.

Never seen the Apollo ties,how were they on the pocket??

---------- Post added at 03:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:57 PM ----------

Hey Garry,

Did a job a few years back for CR Smith on Jurys Hotel Dublin used 3mm wire lashing into fixed anchors,think job was about 150m long x 24 m high, Job was solid as a rock..
 
CelticWarrior

No Problem with Wire Lashing from eye bolt to Scaffold when you can get a kick of the Building Facade with Tranies and or Bracing...its when the Facade has to be clear of kick Tubes...
 
Spot on Gar - ties have to resist compressive & tensile loads (as well as a certain amount of lateral loading)
 
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