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TW
23rd July 2012, 06:00 PM
These ties are meant to go into the ring beam at floor level. Shocking

aom
23rd July 2012, 06:08 PM
They don't have to go in to the ring beam especially as the ring beam is very thin now. We put them in on a stud, preferably backed up with a load bearing partition but that is still shocking, does no one catch 2 standards any more?

joebag
23rd July 2012, 06:36 PM
put 180 of the concrete ones in a hotel in liverpool,into the concrete floor was specified yet when bursting through the stainless steel cap we started to discover air pockets and bit of cans bottles etc not letting us get a good purchase,never used them on timber frames yet but to just screw them into timber doesnt seem right to me,will get the pull tester on it and see what it fails at,even though im not qualified lol

TW
23rd July 2012, 07:08 PM
I have only ever seen them into the ring beams, usually as per design ! Depends on where the floor level is for catching two standards. if the floor is at mid lift its usually knee braced back to lift above. Went to a site today, ties to steel from top kwikstage guardrail at mid bay, top lift only at 8m. Totally shocking what some of these scaffold companies are handing over as complete.

joebag
23rd July 2012, 07:19 PM
on these steel and concrete projects a lot of the floors have been 4 m mate,by design i dont now but worked out perfectly for lift heights,probably arrogant to think it was just for the scaffs;)

Gerscaff
23rd July 2012, 07:21 PM
System Scaffolders Eh? Tsk Tsk

aom
23rd July 2012, 08:44 PM
I have only ever seen them into the ring beams, usually as per design ! Depends on where the floor level is for catching two standards. if the floor is at mid lift its usually knee braced back to lift above. Went to a site today, ties to steel from top kwikstage guardrail at mid bay, top lift only at 8m. Totally shocking what some of these scaffold companies are handing over as complete.

The lift height problem is why we never just put them in the cassette's, we consulted with the NHBC before proceeding to confirm and also the kit manufacturer which was also the builder.

Joe,

They work a treat in timber frame and pass a pull test no problem.

timthumb
23rd July 2012, 09:26 PM
Our engineer says we can put them in the cassette and off 1 standard if it impedes the lift access ....
The drawing will be interesting

aom
23rd July 2012, 09:30 PM
If the engineer says it's ok then it will be more than likely ok but for me it's poor but live and learn.

joebag
23rd July 2012, 10:16 PM
yes you can put them off one standard but their is a ratio to adhere to im sure,,,,i just dont know it :blink:

aom
23rd July 2012, 10:38 PM
It's certainly changed since I was at school then, we always do the 2 standards and probably always will. Might well be old fashioned but it's my ball.:cool:

marra watson
24th July 2012, 06:25 PM
ahahah nice 1 aom you allways took ay ball home when beat now didnt you lol its my ball ahahha, this are diffrenbt type of ties thye have to wood thread on them (rawl plug thread) but you crnt tie in with normall appollo ties can you therw the chip board that nuts

Gerscaff
24th July 2012, 07:01 PM
Your Like Me Alister I Was Always Taught Tie Both Legs, So I Always Tie Both Legs, The Hse Are Quite Big On That With System Scaffolds.Might Be Old Fashioned But If It Aint Broke Why Fix It?

Alan Reade
25th July 2012, 01:50 AM
These ties are meant to go into the ring beam at floor level. Shocking

This is a sh1t example of a tie.
These ties must be into the structural element of the building.
A pull test on this would prove nothing other than the quality of the tie into the board. It would not tell you that the board would mostlikley break or pull off the structure.

As for the location, shocking.
Good pratice dictates your tie should be across two standards.
Good Pratice dictates that your tie is not at mid lift but close to a node.
Good pratice dictates that should your tie fall as pictured you create a braced dummy lift or brace the tie bach to the node point.
All in all a poor piece of work and your Engineer may want to take a propper look at it.
regards Alan

joebag
25th July 2012, 08:23 AM
what is the number you can go off a single standard alan,we had a 3 board access independent and we had to raise ledger bracing to the top handrail and put ties off one standard on certain lifts for access as it was very tight,just followed the design but is their a ratio for the amount if you needed to go off one standard,obviously ideally 2 but sometimes it aint happening :D

Alan Reade
25th July 2012, 10:21 AM
I’m not sure there is an acceptable ratio to speak of.
A tie to a single location standard or ledger is restricted to low scaffolds with a limited tie value of 3.5kN. this in turn still cannot be at mid height on a lift as the bending would be in excess of the allowable (let alone the combined bending from the vertical load)

The connection of scaffold to ties is covered in TG20:5.6 paragraph 3
Ties should be attached to both the inside and outside ledgers or standards at a point not more than 300mm from a ledger braced standard, and as near to a node point as possible. Where this hinders access along a platform, attachment to the inside ledger or standard only is permissible. This would limit the capacity of the tie assembly to the value of the strength of the fitting.