Cpd

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outward bound

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“‘HSE Inspectors sometimes come across scaffolders on site who are not up to date on current accepted practices with respect to safe erection and dismantling of scaffolding. This is an issue that is easily resolved through CPD and HSE welcomes the introduction of this into the CISRS scheme.

this was posted from or on behalf of CISRS - this should be enforced onto the companies and not the Scaffolders - the funding for the course is a big problem since the wages of the Scaffolders do not go up as much as they should. I would openly accept this if the CISRS was classed as a professionally recognized institution such as IOSH where to the IOSH membership you need to complete so many hours of CPD each year.... the problem is that scaffolders only need the card to work on site which is a skilled based profession and not classed as a academic based skill "like" engineering. my point is they either make it harder or raise the bar for scaffolders or they make it compulsory on enforce all scaffolding companies to become NASC certified and enforce the CPD from the employers - some employers are still making employees pay for their training through an agreed contract which is basically forced on them if they want a job - will this be another complication within the employment of scaffolders ? I think there needs to be a full plan in place before things of this nature comes into affect - CPD is a good thing but there seems to be no strategy as to how this will employed into the industry.

words for thoughts .....

OW
 
Maybe it will take a realistic challenge & an alternative solution for this.
Larger companies should have the weight to look at alternatives.
I would suggest this rest with the employer to ensure their employees are kept up to date with changes in working practices & legislation.
Cant see why a CBT module is not appropriate!
 
Thats because there wouid be no money in those suggestions

---------- Post added at 01:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:33 PM ----------

The nasc give nothing away for nothing
 
outward bound said:
“‘HSE Inspectors sometimes come across scaffolders on site who are not up to date on current accepted practices with respect to safe erection and dismantling of scaffolding. This is an issue that is easily resolved through CPD and HSE welcomes the introduction of this into the CISRS scheme.

this was posted from or on behalf of CISRS - this should be enforced onto the companies and not the Scaffolders - the funding for the course is a big problem since the wages of the Scaffolders do not go up as much as they should. I would openly accept this if the CISRS was classed as a professionally recognized institution such as IOSH where to the IOSH membership you need to complete so many hours of CPD each year.... the problem is that scaffolders only need the card to work on site which is a skilled based profession and not classed as a academic based skill "like" engineering. my point is they either make it harder or raise the bar for scaffolders or they make it compulsory on enforce all scaffolding companies to become NASC certified and enforce the CPD from the employers - some employers are still making employees pay for their training through an agreed contract which is basically forced on them if they want a job - will this be another complication within the employment of scaffolders ? I think there needs to be a full plan in place before things of this nature comes into affect - CPD is a good thing but there seems to be no strategy as to how this will employed into the industry.

words for thoughts .....

OW
Click to expand...

If it was a professional accreditation like IOSH you would be required to pay £100+ to stay a member of the body. Then you would still be required to prove your hours of CPD so would probably end up costing more than the CPD course in the long run.

The training centres would run the course but then you would have to pay a membership on top. Can't see many people agreeing with that but possibly good in principle.

It's the companies who have to make sure your trained and competent in your chosen profession and if they don't keep you up to dat how can you prove your competence?

The problem is that the rates for scaffolders have gone down because the rates for scaffold companies have gone down from the main contractors, the main contractor wants you to work for the guidance but isn't willing to pay for it, which in turn means that employers trying to run a company have to choose which bills they pay first, lads wages, tax, fuel bill, courses, Pope etc.

Il probably get slated for that but that's how I see it at the moment, it should be the companies to pay but I agree it will be passed onto the the self employed in some cases.

Can we claim it back?
 
TomP, I don't disagree with most of what you are pointing out, however, within the oil & gas industry (both onshore & offshore), most of what has been proposed re the CPD content s already addressed. There is also several categories which are not relevant.
That said; one a scaffolder has a CISRS card the area of work is not restricted to this sector.
I still stand by my previous post whereas a CBT may be the better option
 
Ellon941 said:
TomP, I don't disagree with most of what you are pointing out, however, within the oil & gas industry (both onshore & offshore), most of what has been proposed re the CPD content s already addressed. There is also several categories which are not relevant.
That said; one a scaffolder has a CISRS card the area of work is not restricted to this sector.
I still stand by my previous post whereas a CBT may be the better option
Click to expand...

Maybe the offshore/onshore companies that do address the content should get together with CISRS and see what they can come up with.
 
If your self employed the simple answer is yes. You are investing in your own business. If your employed and you claim yearly mileage expenses then this can also be claimed against your tax code. Ensure you get a full vat receipt for your course.
 
This was the response that I was expecting and to be honest probably the CISRS scheme management "committee was expecting the same reaction".

there are always things that you can claim against - but the companies can easily put the cost down to expenses or receive funding if this is available. the problem for me is that this is a training card that is used as evidence that you have received sufficient training to enable you to gain access onto site to carryout your work. Although this is a training organization which has become extremely well known through out the world it is worth remembering that it is training that it provides and is not CITB, which brings into effect how will this work for CISRS overseas cards which is delivered differently to the UK courses. CISRS is the training part and not the qualification. the qualification part is the N.V.Q which can be achieved through a number of different ways. my point is CPD should be targeted at qualifications and training providers unless enforced by the qualification body onto to the training scheme. The CPD does not affect the qualification part.
 
It's much the same as an HGV licence, try renewing that without proof of CPD. Also, the story at the top regarding an HSE inspector coming across two scaffs without sufficient knowledge is simply not true. This has been on the cards for years.
 
you can renew your lgv without cpd but you cant get a job outwith the military without it this was brought in to stop a lot of foreign labour in the transport market it again money money money I was on the HGV one what a load of crap they have to spin it out for each module total ball buster

---------- Post added at 11:03 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:02 AM ----------

customer care loading unloading tacho what a load of crap
 
If CPD is going to be required to erect scaffolding then where does this leave the 2 day inspection specialists that can tell us whether our scaffolds are safe or not :)
 
Continual Professional Development.

---------- Post added at 03:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:30 PM ----------
Double-Standards said:
If CPD is going to be required to erect scaffolding then where does this leave the 2 day inspection specialists that can tell us whether our scaffolds are safe or not :)
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I don't see the relevance, but just to be clear, anyone embarrassed by a 2 day scaffold inspector is in fact in dire need of additional training.
 
Cpd mist bosiet.......... Where will these acronyms end ?????? . It used to be citb and Rgit that was all you needed or so we were told ! ! ! !

Sent from my Archos 80c Xenon using Tapatalk
 
Your right, but I'm sure you will be more upset when you have to shell out cash to undertake one of these courses.
 
lmk said:
Continual Professional Development.

---------- Post added at 03:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:30 PM ----------



I don't see the relevance, but just to be clear, anyone embarrassed by a 2 day scaffold inspector is in fact in dire need of additional training.
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Then you aren't looking hard enough. If you need continued development to erect scaffolding then surely you would need continued development in the associated trade to determine whether a scaffold is fit for purpose. The training centres can't have it all ways.
 
Your barking up the wrong tree. This has nothing to do with the training centres.
 
But don't us half witted scaffolders with no modicum of understanding of how our game works after 36 years just bolting tubes to each other,
not these days just follow a drawing because we are so thick that anything with more then 2 boarded lifts is beyond our Neanderthal comprehension
 
Double-Standards said:
Then you aren't looking hard enough. If you need continued development to erect scaffolding then surely you would need continued development in the associated trade to determine whether a scaffold is fit for purpose. The training centres can't have it all ways.
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They will - "a CISRS SITS qualification will remain valid for a 5 year period. At which point the delegate will be required to re sit to course and renew their CISRS SITS card in order to maintain their inspection status"
 
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